THen please explain to me what this extract is saying, because it seems to say that Gdb is power gain, not voltage gain. What I'm basically looking for is an explanation of dB that refers explicitly specifically to amplitude gain in dB rather than power gain.
Someone said earlier than until the advent digital signal processing, power gain has almost always been more important and that's why definitions are the way they are. So far it seems that the 10log power and 20log amplitude formulas only allow me to say that the the power gain is X dB from the input and output power of X, or that the amplitude gain has resulted in a power increase of X dB. I'm looking for the formula that would let me say the voltage gain is X dB.
The decibel (dB) is a logarithmic unit of measurement that expresses the magnitude of a physical quantity (usually power or intensity) relative to a specified or implied reference level. Since it expresses a ratio of two quantities with the same unit, it is a dimensionless unit. A decibel is one tenth of a bel (B).
Which because power increases logrhythmicaly in respect to voltage they are VERY much not the same.
Let me please insert my foot in my mouth, thanks dougy =)
As tesla stated though a DB is not a DB is not a DB.
I assume you have examples where a dB isn't a dB, such as where the dB power gain is different from the dB voltage gain etc.
The point I was trying to make is that the 10log and 20log thing is simply an artifice to measure power ratios - you still get the same dBs. I think if you consult any authoritive reference you will find the bel is defined as log10 of a power ratio. It is then consistent to define it also as 2log10 of an amplitude ratio.
The bel is DEFINED as a power ratio? Okay, that's the type of thing I was looking for. So dB is always the power ratio for something or resulting power from whatever ratio of whatever amplitudes, and there is no such thing as dB to represent an amplitude ratio (though the dB can be converted with the 20log formula to produce the voltage ratio that would caues it). THen it makes sense to use 20log for amplitudes the resultant dB always represents a power.
But dBV? I've personally never seen a dBV. But the main thing I was concerned about is if you ran across a dB that was calculated using an amplitude, but you weren't sure whether the dB represented a power gain or an amplitude gain. If dB is always defined as a power gain, then you always know which formula to use (10log if you want to calculate the linear power gain, or 20log if you want to calculate the amplitude gain that produces that power gain).
EDIT: Okay, so it would seem dBV is using 1V as a reference, so I would think this technically means it is using the power in a 1V signal as the reference...with the actual power depending on the details of the system.
I suppose it also removes some confusion if dB is always a power ratio...you just say dB and the user can use whatever formula they want to convert that power ratio to a resultant linear power ratio or linear amplitude ratio. If there are power dB and amplitude dB floating around then if someone gets lazy and just writes dB rather than dB_there would be more confusion than there already is in practical matters.
Tesla, simple example, decibel sound pressure vs decibel power. No device is for acoustical reproduction is completely linear.
The bel is DEFINED as a power ratio? Okay, that's the type of thing I was looking for. So dB is always the power ratio for something or resulting power from whatever ratio of whatever amplitudes.
To calculate the ratio of 1 kW (one kilowatt, or 1000 watts) to 1 W in decibels, use the formula **broken link removed**
**broken link removed**
- To calculate the ratio of 1 mW (one milliwatt) to 10 W in decibels, use the formula
**broken link removed**
- To find the power ratio corresponding to a 3 dB change in level, use the formula
Is this okay Tesla?
Now repeat carefully after me:
a dB is a dB is a dB
There are no such things as power dBs or amplitude dBs.
The thing that makes it possible to measure dBs using either amplitude or power ratios is that the number of dBs is 10 log a power ratio or 20 log an amplitude ratio. It's that simple.
It sounds like Matlab presents this in some confusing way, I don't have it so can't test it.
And you're still confused with how to spell it =)I also used to be confused about Db, power and voltage relationships. If I raise the volume of my stereo by 6Db, I've doubled the voltage going to the speakers and quadrupled the power going to the speakers, and my ears hear a 6Db increase. Power is up by 6Db. Voltage is up by 6Db.
Also,
Logarithmic = Exponential.
There is no difference.
For example, the cutoff frequency is defined as the -3dB point for POWER...not amplitude.
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