What's your education level?

Well, there are two different kinds of education:

the first is the one earning your living and life style and the other one being general education.

I have met many people all over the world and I found out that there are huge differences concerning the latter.

Thai people are convinced that the world mainly consists of Thailand with a few other other countries (nations) around which are their neighbors like Myanmar (former Birma), Laos, Cambodia and Malaysia.

They further believe that they are leaders in technology as for having invented the sun, the moon, the steam engine and electricity.

Their calendar is 543 years ahead of that in the western world and those great inventions certainly call for a recreation phase which still goes on.

Since I've been living in Thailand for almost eight years people in our village now willingly take my advice concerning techniques - making them save money on double or triple spare part purchase.

That was just one example of general education.

On another occasion I took my car to a repair shop to have all brakes checked and replaced if necessary. I watched the mechanic closely and his statement was none of the brake shoes had to be replaced since there was still 1mm (0.04") layer on them. He asked me why I would want to have the brakes replaced which I answered telling that I'm used to driving speeds up to 290kmh on the autobahn and I need good brakes for that reason.

He broke out in laughter and asked me why I would need a fast car if all the roads were full of bomb craters from WWII. (That happened 1968!)

Take your guess about that country.

In the GAF (German Air Force) knowing and performing the primary job was not a subject to discuss. It had to be 100%.

The secondary job was the one deciding about career. I was social officer at my squadron and fixed marriages of pilot comrads and their wives.

I had a lot to do during that time since wives generally don't like the idea to be married on paper, but wish their husband and father of their children around in the family.

Changing an assignment every few months between foreign jobs surely kills one or another family life.

Boncuk

I've a BE in Electrical and Electronic Engineering and now I’m working in research. I graduated just this time last year and worked very hard to get my degree.
As Buncuk said above

Boncuk said:

Well, there are two different kinds of education:

Click to expand...

What you go through in college should be an inspirational journey exploring the wonders of the field you chose but it’s not. It’s a struggle to prove that your capable of handling serious pressure and can produce the results that are expected of you. For this I hate college, for many other reasons I loved it
Don’t get me wrong now, interest is the key without it you don’t go anywhere, but what college is looking for is the persistence to fight on and get to the end of a horrifyingly busy year cause they have sucked all of the interest out already by over loading the students.
That is why sometimes you meet highly qualified people that seem to not have a clue. They do have a clue, otherwise they wouldn’t be where they are, they just need time to pick up and enjoy what they are meant to be doing, or its cause they just can't stomach a technical conversation with some who is has something to prove.

Buncuk, if you think there are only two methods of education I'm sorry but you're very much incorrect, just from a different perspective.
Education is a process where by someone learns, and it can sometimes be reversed from specific conceptual measures.

Sceadwian said:

Buncuk, if you think there are only two methods of education I'm sorry but you're very much incorrect, just from a different perspective.

Click to expand...

Oops, looks like a math formula to me.

I didn't say with one word there two methods of education and haven't mentioned one method to become educated.
By methods of education I understand the way to become educated, e.g. reading, studying drawings, watching animated functional descriptions etc.

So your formula contains nothing but hot air if spoken. It is always easy to make a statement telling his "personal and only truth", but its also an excellent way to prove someones personal poor general eduction.

Education is a process where by someone learns, and it can sometimes be reversed from specific conceptual measures.

Click to expand...

My education is not good enough to decipher anything of the second sentence you wrote.

If it means you can reverse the process of education by reversing it you certainly have reversed your conceptual measures quite often IMHO.

Boncuk

It's not level. It's always increasing.

Did anyone here hit the jackpot like I did? Half a year out of college and now I’m sitting in a cushy research position with good prospects of a PHD. BooYeah!

Hi EVERBODY,
If I've read your opinion up here, I'll never cosider wasting all those years studying and discovering electronics aspects. I'm sure you do not meant to give the upcoming students a message of leave education and start doing it your self.

I agree the experince is important, but alingment is required by education. Thats my view.

I think that education teaches one thing (which I think is invaluable).. The ability to find / source information.... Once you have the information you need you're away.....

If all that college / Uni does is give you that ability..... Its well worth it.... Employer's do look at qualification when they are taking on staff... But experience, whether you have a degree or not, plays a bigger part. That's just my opinion.

Boncuk, your statement of the 'two types of education' is the hot air in my opinion, the statement is blatantly false. The are countless types of education to attempt to simplify it by declaring that there is only one side or the other discounts rational reality that education like everything else in life is dynamic and personal to each individual.

lebevti said:

Just wondering what people on a site like this have as their education....Are most people here not degreed but have figured things out on their own?

Or are u degreed in Electrical Engineering? do u have a B.S, M.S., or even a PhD?

perhaps u went to ITT Tech or similar school and have an electronics associates degree?

are u a technician?

are u degreed in something else besides EE?

myself, I have a B.S. in EE

Click to expand...

In a few years I will finally pull the plug on a career in electronics engineering that has spanned over 40 years and to be quite honest has been one hell of a ride.

My father was an EE and I inherited his genes I guess. I was into amateur radio as a kid and got my first license at age 13 in 1963 when you actually had to know something to get an amateur radio license. Keep in mind my early self and father taught education in electronics at this point was vacuum tubes with a few then new transistors.

Don't worry as I am going somewhere with the rambling....

I graduated HS in 1968 with no hope or aspirations of college and in 1969 with draft notice in hand (remember Vietnam) I enlisted in the US Marine Corps. I ended up in Avionics but more important was busy seeking every electronic school I could get to postpone the inevitable trip to Vietnam. Eventually the odds caught up with me and Goodbye NC and Hello Vietnam. I survived the worst summer vacation of my life and returned to the states.

Stationed in CA. I began attending classes at Cal State and reenlisted in the Marine Corps. Several of my NTC peoples I grew up with were killed in Vietnam and many having drug issues. There was nothing to really go home to and if many remember the early 70s in the US were a depression. Screw it all, there were no good jobs for me so I went to school and remained in the Marine Corps. I was using my VA benefits. The Marine Corps was putting beanies and weenies on the table and getting me a formal education I figured I needed. Was not great but not all that shabby.

Getting to the point............ be patient.

I earned my EE finally and actually worked like hell for the damn thing. I was pleasantly surprised at the credits I was given for my experience at that point. I continued in the Corps and considered OCS but the grass was greener for me on the other side of the fence. Working for a VIP Naval Command at the time I choose to leave the Marine Corps and start working for DoD (Department of Defense). For another 10 years I worked DoD with a focus on ECM (Electronic Countermeasure Systems) and other fun and exciting stuff. During my DoD years my daughter was born in NC and my son in (of all places) Naples Italy.

I left DoD over 20 years ago and have been at the same job ever since, even at one location which has merit. There is also maybe a downside. Today, all those years later my job is limited in scope. Not to say mundane but there is no need to explore so many new and changing technologies. As to me? I am tired of learning things I don't want to learn and wish for more time to better learn the things I have more interest in. I figure in a few years I will do just that.

My take is simple as to education in general . A good education and a successful person is a combination of book smarts combined with shall we say street smarts. Many of us simply sought a degree because it was a pre requisite for more money (beanies and weenies) at the time. The real education comes with years of experience and what is called wisdom.

Just My Take
Ron

Sceadwian said:

Boncuk, your statement of the 'two types of education' is the hot air in my opinion, the statement is blatantly false. The are countless types of education to attempt to simplify it by declaring that there is only one side or the other discounts rational reality that education like everything else in life is dynamic and personal to each individual.

Click to expand...

With all due respect, I think you're taking this way too seriously. Sure, technically there is an infinite number of types of education, but think about it broadly. With his post, it makes complete sense to say there are two types. It's sort of an idiom that you need to take with a grain of salt, and take it in context.

Regards

Sceadwian said:

Boncuk, your statement of the 'two types of education' is the hot air in my opinion, the statement is blatantly false. The are countless types of education to attempt to simplify it by declaring that there is only one side or the other discounts rational reality that education like everything else in life is dynamic and personal to each individual.

Click to expand...

OK, I stand corrected. So from now on let's call them two main fields of education - namely work/profession and general education.

So you managed to keep your feet on the ground (instead of parking them on his desk) while being interviewed by your employer and he invites you for a night dinner. (for a good reason)

The dinner runs smooth until you decide to vomit into the decolletee of your future bosses wife.

I guess you'll be fired before even being get hired. (lack of general education)

BTW, the man telling me about the bomb craters in our autobahns was an American citizen.

Believe me, we won't enjoy people like him visiting Germany as well as we won't enjoy dogmatic persons!

Boncuk

He broke out in laughter and asked me why I would need a fast car if all the roads were full of bomb craters from WWII. (That happened 1968!)

Take your guess about that country.

Click to expand...

BTW, the man telling me about the bomb craters in our autobahns was an American citizen.

Click to expand...

So you are saying the ignorance of some random American nobody in 1968 is a accurate measure of our entire educational system today in 2012 some 44 years later?

tcmtech said:

So you are saying the ignorance of some random American nobody in 1968 is a accurate measure of our entire educational system today in 2012 some 44 years later?

Click to expand...

You obviously hit the point: WWII ended 1945 and I talked about the year of 1968. That makes 23 years according to general arithmetics.

Go figure!

Well see post 18 for my thoughts.

Trust me as an American I can assure you most of us are well aware of the clueless dolts that travel the world or show up on international news representing us (not including our government officials either.)

They don't represent the majority but unfortunately its hard to prove that to the rest of the world.

Hi tcmtech,

I guess nobody has to prove anything to the rest of the world - as long as you don't consider any other country than the USA being part of the rest of the world.

Reminds me of the speech of one of our presidents (Heinrich Luebke) who held it in an African country starting with "Liebe Neger and Negerinnen ..."

("Dear negroes and female negroes ...") The country he visited was Ghana, but he was senile enough to forget about the country's name.

Very much to my surprise it were jewish US citicens with the highest general education level when I visited the USA twice.

The first time 1968 to 1969 and the second time 1975 to 1976.

No matter what theme you decided to work at, they always could participate with a great deal of knowledge. Most of all they surprised me with great knowledge about geography, which leads to another story concerning average german house wives' geographic knowledge.

A woman spent her holidays on the Baleares (spanish island group in the Mediterranean Sea). Returning home she was asked where she spent her holidays she proudly replied "Baleares" and further asked where they are supposed to be located she replied :"I don't know where. I flew there."

Boncuk

P.S. No soup is eaten at the same temperature as it is being cooked.

A woman spent her holidays on the Baleares (spanish island group in the Mediterranean Sea).

Click to expand...

The English name for this island goup is the Balearic Islands which comprises the islands of Menorca, Majorca, Ibiza and Formentera.

If you want an example of people who should not be allowed out of their home country, take a look at some of the Brits who spend their two weeks holiday in a drunken stupour (spelling?) getting sunburnt until they look like lobsters on the island of Ibiza.

I am sure that most of them have no idea where they are in the world, just beamed up courtesy of messers Boeing and Airbus.

JimB

Gotta say what a laugh and the members THAT have a trade or degree have shown out, ReloadRon great read mate on your lifes work and I so know Boncuk is great experienced guy in electronics. TVTech has also shown the ol' school is a dying trade. Now look at this forum expert with NO formal schooling and no further trades/degrees he still is apparently in everything giving advise..... Go figure.

Bit about my life......

I am a Mechanical fitter/welder by trade these days and the heavy machining is long gone from this country, when I was living in the Pilbara instead of going to the pub every night I sat down with a slow modem and learnt electronics from scratch. What got me into that well I got a 4wd drive FJ55 dual cab ute with no engine and the wiring all shot. My mate said to me best to learn so I totally rewired it and with my learning put in a 20x4lcd to show the important car functions etc.

From there I have gone thru a 6 year job of repairing industrial gearbox's to 5 tom (and sometimes 8 ton...) and seeing so-called tradesmen working along side that don't have a clue and won't be told either. I talked with a mate to make some new gears and now he is finding trouble soursing EN36A to make the gears...... So his quote which will be several thousand $ is waning......

Todays job was fixing a semenalar/wheat germ seperator that spins at 2800rpm, due to vibration the machine was shutdown and I did find the input coupling was approx 1/16" out of wack. The front motor mount had broken and the front input bearing journal had worn done over 3mm. So with a new 1-1/2" 1045 bright bar shaft I put all those crude fabricated impellers back on the right way. Now in oder to both statically and dynamically balance this impeller shaft I made a crude knife edge jig being 200x10mm flatbar on a 60 degree angle so the edge of the flatbar will serve as the knife edge. It took me about 3 hours to get it balanced and I will take my digi camera into work on monday and take a pic. For a guy to take a job on like this is my daily task but I am getting old(48 in August). I got the boss out to have a look and he went out after I locked and said to me just after I left it was as close to balanced a fabrication can do.

With what they pay it comforting to atleast have a wage as us ol' guys as us are thrown on the heap with mining jobs etc.

Anyway with electronics I can now design a board in linux and print it out then iron it on to etch it. So ya being able to make your own PCB board is a bonus and figuring out the circuit first.

Lets see the young kids that think they are so great do what we guy's did when life was worth it

It is a shame young kids today are so bold to say they know nothing but expect us older folk to look after it well there is so much supply then nothing with bearings too. When I started in 80' there were 600 apprenticeships 3 years later they closed it. So from '84 let's say enginearing has gone to the dog's.

Anyway enough of me


Regards Bryan

Another education note. Those of us living in the US watched the entire economy tumble several years ago. Collapse may be a better choice of words. Fortunately neither my wife who manages a small television station or myself were scathed at all by the recession and fortunately neither were my kids who have kids of their own.

I began looking at let's call them the survivors of the financial meltdown. Overall the trades fared fairly well and when I say trades I refer to the butcher, baker and candlestick maker along with electricians, plumbers, and other skilled trades which do not require a degree or college education. Many hard hit were managers in business and general management positions where a business degree is required. Many of those jobs are gone and will likely never return.

What I feel is important is doing something you enjoy doing. Going to work should not be something disliked or dreaded. Also, finding a position that is important enough to an employer that others will be out the door before you when hard financial times hit. While nobody is indispensable or irreplaceable it helps to find work that makes you happy and pays well.

Electronics was my little nitch and of most important paid the bills and kept me eating over all those years. The fact that it worked for me is here nor there. Likely if I had it all to do again I would have pursued mechanical engineering or gone into the trades as a carpenter.

My observation here in the US is that for those who choose a career field and work to achieve goals and milestones will have some success.

I have always enjoyed Boncuk's post both in this off topic area and the mainstream forums. Anyone who could master the F4 Phantom has always held a special place with me. I just always questioned their sanity.

Ron

bryan1 said:

Gotta say what a laugh and the members THAT have a trade or degree have shown out, ReloadRon great read mate on your lifes work and I so know Boncuk is great experienced guy in electronics. TVTech has also shown the ol' school is a dying trade. Now look at this forum expert with NO formal schooling and no further trades/degrees he still is apparently in everything giving advise..... Go figure.

Click to expand...

Thank You friend. There is nothing like being taught (spelling) by the very best of the best....you never make mistakes ever....because your knowledge is everything they have learn't in their life .......and they are willing to share it with you.

I know very few people like this.

My basics are rock solid.

Because I was lucky enough to be guided by a true Pro.

And listened..and wrote everything down that he taught me( spelliing again!!).

Time to go,

Tv Tech