Chip unlocking, extracting source

Nigel Goodwin said:

No, you were floating a criminal topic - there's no honest reason to want to break security on a chip.

Click to expand...

The poster described an entirely legitimate reason to want to get the code out of a chip. Unlike some people, mere mortals can misplace original files or make changes that ended up not being desirable.

Instead of taking the question at face value, Nigel took it upon himself to call the poster a criminal or stupid. Not very moderate behavior from a moderator is it?

Nigel Goodwin said:

Assuming the code was truly yours?, and you were stupid enough to lock the PIC and lose the code?, then you need to rewrite it - but breaking security protection on micros would be a fairly serious offence.

Click to expand...

I have an ATMEL project that I write-upload-test, write-upload-test, write-upload-test,.....
Hours and hours and hours of writing and trying and sometimes my source could use better commenting because a version a bunch of tries ago works better than the current version. But I can't go back, and don't know which bit I flipped to get the better results then, and a progression to not working.
I have 67 iterations of source for just one module change. A lot of searching to find the needle.
Wish I'd hit save a lot more often before getting frustrated and immediately starting to edit and make changes and hit upload..
"What did I change, cause now it doesn't work at all."
Would be nice to wind the clock back, but lessons learned (like backing up more often).

Nigel Goodwin said:

No, you were floating a criminal topic - there's no honest reason to want to break security on a chip.

Click to expand...

Do I trust the IC-breaker companies.
Nooooo.....

But they (some) do include in their list of satisfied customers a very compelling list of whose-who in the hardware development world.
Organizations I would not cast shadows for using this type of service.
Companies I could only ever wish to be on their pay-roll.
Let's say for the sake of argument Zenith, had an earthquake eat their plant in Mexico were they used to make their PM/PZ line of descramblers.
The servers and backup images all gone.
For security the chips and files were only kept there, safe as in mamma's arms.
But now, all files gone. Only working product remains, but there will be no new product once this runs out.

The argument that "there is no honest reason" is too broad to be accurate.
I am not Zenith, but I am also not to be called a crook on a whim.

Have you tried using Dropbox? I use it for storing everything. Apart from making the files nearly instantly available on any of my computers, if you access it through their web site, it saves older versions for a period of time – a month I think. It's been a life saver a few times.

I have new policies on backing things up. Hella-redundant now.
I don't cloud anything (guess that should remain my secret), because I don't control it, I don't trust it, I am a guest and at their mercy so long as they remain viable, and if it were possible to hack it, I wouldn't know unless someone deleted my work, or shared it (dark-web).
Thanks for a really good suggestion though.
I do use that, but only for sharing files with others that I have backed-up.
Let's be real, mostly cat pics.

No puppy pictures? Awwwww.

Awww, I love puppies !!!

I have this skill that I don;t advertise, but I can usually pick combo locks of the L-R-L or R-L-R variety in about 20 minutes. My moms frien'd husband died and the son was a millionaire. he could not find anyone to open the husband's safe. It usually takes me alittle longer to find the combination. That wasn't required. I can't do multi-turns or more than 3 numbers.

The algorithm, I created in high school when I had time on my hands.

Nothing like the rush when that lock pops, every lock has vulnerabilities.
once you know, you'll never look at it the same.

To quote someone we all know...

Click-Here said:

Learn to pick your locks, and you may find yourself replacing all your old ones.

Click to expand...

I sure did !!!

(oops, another should-be-secret)

Watch "The Lock Picking Lawyer" on YouTube. You'll never feel secure again.

Yes, he does reveal vulnerabilities in locks....in hopes the manufacturers will correct their deficiencies.

Nigel Goodwin said:

No, you were floating a criminal topic - there's no honest reason to want to break security on a chip.

Click to expand...

This statement is just wrong and a bit narrow minded.
I bypass security on mcu's every single day and there is nothing criminal in what I do. I even do work for most all major dealers in my area when they don't know what else to do. Which is more often then they would like you to believe. Bypassing security in my field is extremely common.
Simple things like adding new keys when all keys are lost in many cases require it. (Yes, I am a licensed security professional so nothing dis honest. I am legally a person to call for replacing lost keys )
Programming replacement parts, adapting used parts, Repairing corrupted data, cloning, etc...
Many of the things I work on are discontinued or near impossible to get so replacing with new parts is not always an option.

Just this morning I had a very pricey ecu come in that was said to have checksum errors in the flash according to the DTC's pulled, so I read (and bypassed) the security on the mpc5xx to pull out the flash and eeprom files to see the checksum and see if it was correct. Also I was able to check the flash programming against known good files of the same type of ecu's. Saved the guy a ton of money with a failed ecu replacement.

Nothing nefarious and all with good reason. Nothing to do with trying to steal code.

narkeleptk said:

Programming replacement parts, adapting used parts, Repairing corrupted data, cloning, etc...
Many of the things I work on are discontinued or near impossible to get so replacing with new parts is not always an option.

Click to expand...

Ahhh, but some people plan a business model on some parts NLA so your only choice is to buy new (ITL!!!)
You are stealing food from the mouths of... blahhh-blahhh-blahhh...

I assume the "y" in lmgtfy.com in this case was for "yourself".

Click-Here said:

I feel heavily attacked for floating an advanced topic.

Click to expand...

Wow, I that makes you feel "heavily attacked" how would you describe the way soldiers feel when they are getting their asses shot at? Don't be such a snowflake.

gophert said:

I assume the "y" in lmgtfy.com in this case was for "yourself".

Wow, I that makes you feel "heavily attacked" how would you describe the way soldiers feel when they are getting their asses shot at? Don't be such a snowflake.

Click to expand...

Think I'll just stand aside and we'll let the others decide what's going on here.

Remember the saying "Locks are for honest people."

So a grad student ask me after hours if I knew the code for the copier to turn it on. He had a good reason for wanting it. I tried a few. BINGO! He was able to make copies of his thesis.

We had an "honor system" storeroom. I'll listen to the reason they want in. If it's good enough, I'll break in. Rule 1: You don;t see me get in. Rule 2: You don't tell anyone in admin who could have the loophole fixed. 3) You sign the stuff out the next day. My boss even wanted in,

I was once given the code for the security system because I was asked to arm it one day. That code I used that day and one more time to silence an alarm after security responded.

Locks buy time.

Locks buy a second chance on a bad decision of a preceived opportunity.
Kinda wordy and could use some massaging, but the concept is there.

Number one thing stolen from most businesses...
Office supplies.

If you're paid by the hour, think carefully about switching to Salary, and speaking of locks, avoid being a key holder.
It may sound glamorous and "a trust thing", but it's more like someone else got sick of chasing 5am false alarms or other always being on-call.

Living across the street from the office, I had the "honor" of being first on the call list from the alarm company. The phone would ring in the middle of the night, and I'd charge across the street to see what had caused the (almost always) false alarm.

One day I finally had the realization – do I really want to get there before the cops??? I took a few minutes after that.