Junebug help??

Sceadwian · May 23, 2009

Couldn't find any links for pro vision C for AVR on google. Not sure why you'd use anything other than the full GCC port, aside from libraries, but you'll pay a premium for those. AVR GCC is free and works under windows or linux, there is plenty of library code out there that'll work with it.

be80be · May 23, 2009

You where talking about getting cheaper parts and now your looking at $4.00 to $6.00 dollar chips.

3v0 · May 24, 2009

Burt has a point.
If you switch to AVR you need a new programmer and about the same startup period you had with PIC's. Why?

You can stay with you current code for between $2 and $2.50 a chip.

If you are going to switch to C you can use the 8 pin PIC devices for about half the price. You can use the Junebug to program them and BootC to write the program.

My suggestion is that you focus. Sell a few units with the current design. If they are popular enough such that squeezing another $1 out of the design will be profitable you can do the redesign while the first rev is being sold.

AVR vrs PIC: People will always want you to use what they use. Not a huge surprise. From the top looking down it does not matter which chip is in the box as long as it works.

You are ready for production? Start selling the thing
If not dot you i's and cross the t's. Finish it.

3v0 (a software engineer)

Pommie · May 24, 2009

3v0 said:
Burt has a point.
If you switch to AVR you need a new programmer and about the same startup period you had with PIC's. Why?

You can stay with you current code for between $2 and $2.50 a chip.

If you are going to switch to C you can use the 8 pin PIC devices for about half the price. You can use the Junebug to program them and BootC to write the program.

My suggestion is that you focus. Sell a few units with the current design. If they are popular enough such that squeezing another $1 out of the design will be profitable you can do the redesign while the first rev is being sold.

AVR vrs PIC: People will always want you to use what they use. Not a huge surprise. From the top looking down it does not matter which chip is in the box as long as it works.

You are ready for production? Start selling the thing
If not dot you i's and cross the t's. Finish it.

3v0 (a software engineer)

Excellent advice.

Mike.

MrDEB · May 24, 2009

misunderstanding about AVR

what ever that is??
NO not planning on switching, the guy I was talking to does alot of work with AVR.
he recommended going with C language.
NO way am I going with AVR. Got to learn to crawl before I can walk.
now on the subject of C, I get these Emails about a coarse in C that is done mostly online.
The C programming course.
anybody tryed this coarse or know any thing about it??
oh and yes I am staying with the present 18Fxxxx PIC seems very popular.

MrDEB · May 24, 2009

here is layout of PC board using SMD

the LM386 is not made any more , need to find a SMD to replace.
the voltage regulator is cheaper going with the 220 package .75 vers $2.50+
board in present design is 2.02 x 1.430 inches.
will try to fit into a 1inch pvc pipe but not real sure about it.
the speaker is 1 1/8" anyway.
???????????????
gads this is fun trying to design something to fit into a wanted size.

Sceadwian · May 24, 2009

For the price I think you can do a lot better with free online tutorials and information MrDeb. I would recommend only learning the basics of C and then immediately purchase a book that is SPECIFICALLY for the PIC C compiler you'll be using because although the basic C syntax is the same for all compilers many of the libraries and details are not standardized, that's what makes it difficult to program in C on micro controllers. I don't know what your location is or what the library situation is in your area, but even basic C books from 20 years ago will teach you the basic syntax and fundamental, in fact the older books tend to be a whole lot simpler. Look around for recommend PIC C books, I'm sure you can do a LOT better than what that web site is offering.

be80be · May 24, 2009

You get more out of the help file with C18 or boostC I don't see why you would change from swordfish. I no your boat hasn't came in. That new BMW in the drive. If you learn Swordfish you can easily uses BootsC. You jump around you'll never learn any language. Just bits of each.

Sceadwian · May 24, 2009

I haven't been following your threads (To Mr Deb) much cause I'm not much of a pic guy. But if you've started on swordfish stick with it, from everything everyone here has said about it it has better libraries than some C compilers and the code for basic is simpler. If you're struggling with swordfish you'll be struggling just as much or more with C. Tough it out, if you get fed up just take a break from it for a little bit. It's going to take you a while to outgrow swordfish if you ever even need to switch to C at all

3v0 · May 24, 2009

misunderstanding about AVR
what ever that is??
NO not planning on switching, the guy I was talking to does alot of work with AVR.

Not a problem.

I agree with Sceadwian regarding learning C. My suggestion is learn C on a PC first then move to the PIC.

Microsoft Visual Studio C++ is an excellent development environment. But you can not use their tutorials to learn much more then the IDE. They use C++ and you are only interested in C. C++ is C with object oriented extension so you can compile and run normal C with a C++ compiler.

There are several tutorials you can use on the web but you need to ignore the parts that do not apply to micro controllers like file IO.

MrDEB · May 24, 2009

I will look into boostC

swordfish is nice but when be80be threw out that last bit of code (so short n simple) I am wondering what to do.
am somewhat happy w/ swordfish but the website looks limited but then I need to learn what the modules are doing.
as for library - very limited as it is a very small library.

be80be · May 24, 2009

MrDeb that was basic to PICBASIC PRO DEMO It has built in commands that make some
things simple to do like sound is real easy with it. With about 4 lines of code you you can make random sounds. Easy, The syntax in picbasic is like what I used when i was using a basic stamp. I started using pic's there cheaper then the stamp. I learned assembly first., Then some C then back to assembly then my head hurt lol. I went with Swordfish and have stayed with it for the 18fxxx chips use assembly for 12fxxx and 16fxxx and if I can't see how to get some code to work I'll write it with picbasic and look at the assembly to see how it did it. And if I want some thing fast I'll use it for that to. But if I had not stayed with one thing I wouldn't no any thing about coding. Because of the syntax and module change from one to the next. You'll
write code that don't work and all it is is the syntax is wrong . Now when I use say swordfish I open the help and it has all you need to write code with and start writing
The help file is the best book out there. Like a data sheet

3v0 · May 24, 2009

Swordfish is about as good as basic gets on a uC.

The short and simple is deceptive. The more you let the language and library do for you the less you can do with it and the more difficult it becomes when things do not work.

BE's intentions were good but I can see how it confused the issue. When helping people it is best to stick to the language/compiler in use.

MrDEB said:
swordfish is nice but when be80be threw out that last bit of code (so short n simple) I am wondering what to do.
am somewhat happy w/ swordfish but the website looks limited but then I need to learn what the modules are doing.
as for library - very limited as it is a very small library.

be80be · May 24, 2009

Telling some one that can't even write code in basic that it's good to use C for 12fxxx and 16fxxx chips. I didn't post no code that used modules. or librarys

Code:

FREQOUT   Pin,Onms,Frequency1{,Frequency2}

It's a statement that's part of picbasic NOT a MODULES OR LIBRARY.
3v0 your right about trying not to use modules and librarys when some thing dosen't work it's hard to find out why if you use them. But most of the time it's because you don't read it all first before you use it.

3v0 · May 24, 2009

MrDEB said:
swordfish is nice but when be80be threw out that last bit of code (so short n simple) I am wondering what to do.

It is best to not confuse new users by switching languages.

i have been encouraging MrDEB to stay with swordfish basic.

blueroomelectronics · May 24, 2009

With a little effort you could write a FREQOUT function for Swordfish. That's the beauty of modular (which PICBASIC isn't)

MrDEB · May 24, 2009

I am going to stay w/ swordfish

as I really want to get the hang of this.
right now I am trying to figure out a very simple battery hookup.
how much easier can it get.
sometimes the simplest solution is the hardest to figure out.
can't see the forest because all the trees are in the way!!

3v0 · May 24, 2009

We can help with that.
Which voltage regulator and or battery are you using ?

MrDEB · May 25, 2009

so simple but dumb I got it figured out

have 2- 3cell AAA bayttery holders
1 - 3 prong female plug
originally wanted the ground in the middle #2 prong
#1 prong = 4.5v
#2 prong = ground
#3 prong 9v
WAS hoping to wire it so plug could go on either way as my original plug is non-polarized.
purchased some polarized 3 prong plugs to avoid end user from connecting plug back on in wrong orientation (I never thought about this thus I applied power to my board and fried a 18F1320 PIC.)
yes I held a memorial service for the little Pic-ie
the plug in question is on my prototype.
attached is what I connected and got the plug backwards = POOF!
now where is that forest??

3v0 · May 25, 2009

I hate it when that happens.

Glad you have it figured out.

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