My Control Circuit

Here's the circuit as it stands. I'm still working on debugging it. RadioRon, would you please take a look at it and see if it matches the simple logic diagram that you posted to assist me on this circuit? It doesn't seem to be acting like its supposed to. It seems the output of the 2 ICs on my main portion matches the voltage of type of chip I'm using.I'm also getting some lower voltages from the transistors which is not desired. I need the voltage to be high enough to power the Warning LED, but as it is, the voltage is possibly too low to run it. It works fine when the Refill LED is illuminated. Otherwise, the 555 portion of circuit on the right hand side is fine. I need help getting the main part of the circuit straightened out. The attached picture shows what I mean by low voltages going to the warning LED and the 555 portion of the circuit.

What's it supposed to do? If it's based on another thread why not continue it?

It's a circuit that I have been working on for about a year and a half trying to get designed. Its intent is to control the operation of a hydrogen on demand cell. Also it is designed to indicate cell operation status with the 4 LEDS.

How should it work?

You really should look at microcontrollers, a single IC plus regulator could do what your trying to do. They're even simple to program.
Scoop: Hydrogen On Demand Fuel Saving Devices A Fraud

Hayato said:

How should it work?

Click to expand...

If I can get it to work right, the two switches that are labeled represent the two sensors that will be in the cell. when the upper sensor opens it activates the LED marked Warn. The cell continues operating until the lower sensor opens then it activates the refill LED, opens refill valves and activates a pump to refill the cell. Like I said I'm still debugging it and I wanted RadioRon, whom created the logic diagram to help me get started, to take a look at the circuit and see if I wired it up correctly to match the logic diagram that he posted for me.

blueroomelectronics said:

You really should look at microcontrollers, a single IC plus regulator could do what your trying to do. They're even simple to program.
Scoop: Hydrogen On Demand Fuel Saving Devices A Fraud

Click to expand...

I know you mean well blueroom, but like I'm all time reiterating, is that I am a noob when it comes to electronics. My original idea for this circuit came from me messing with relays and wires taken off school buses. I wouldn't know where to start in creating a circuit to do what I desire, and I also don't know enough about programming that I would have a hard time creating a program to operate the microcontroller. That article you posted is possibly by someone associated with the petroleum industry trying to dissuade people from using hydrogen on demand systems to increase fuel economy. There is so much disinformation out there that is slowing the introduction of alternative energy sources into the mainstream.

What is that LM555 doing there? I don't want to be mean, but your schematic is a bit confusing. Too many unused components.

LM555 Vcc is wired at the wrong place, wire it directly at 12V.

I think that you can do it with logic components only. Just a few transistors to boost output, if needed.

The 555 Timer controls the flashing of the warn LED when the refill LED is lit. It indicates that the cell is in the process of being refilled. It is controlled by the Warn (Q3) section of the circuit. I've been working on the circuit since I posted it and have changed some bits and pieces of it as I've been debugging it. I had to reduce the R7 (1K) from Q3 (Warn) to 500 Ohm in order to get the Warn LED to illuminate. I'm still attempting to get the output of the 4011 and 4093 to do as I want. That is what is bothering me.

For example. U2D that controls "operation LED".

Why are you using a NAND gate? You realize that you are inverting the NAND output with a transistor?

Use a AND gate with a transistor instead, with the LED connected in series with a resistor and the collector.

Same with Refill LED, you have a bunch of logic gates, why not use them to control that LED? You have Schmitt Triggers logic gates, use them to control that led as well.

Can you attach the Multisim file?

Ron made a RS latch with NOR gates, I do not see any NOR gates in your schematic.

Multisim File

Sure. Here's the file attached. I was recommended to use a 4093 and 4011 by radioron. Only the LEDs are controlled by the 2N3094 transistors. I needed it to activate the LEDs when the when the sensors are open. And in the case of the operation LED, the transistor illuminates the Operation LED when the sensors are closed. The setup I'm using makes it so when the input is high the output is low.

How are you generating the Hydrogen?

I don't have my cell built yet, but I plan on using pulsed current using a PWM, possibly the design by ZeroFossilFuel. The cell will use stainless steel plates submerged in a electrolyte solution of Sodium Hydroxide.

Is it for a vehicle?
You do realize it takes 2.5x more energy to create the Hydrogen than burning it produces. And that Stan Meyers 47kHz is way too low a frequency to separate the atoms, you need several GHz.

What I was trying to say was:



Use B.

That simulation file you sent seems to be working.

What Blueroom is saying is very true. Adding Hydrogen to your fuel wont improve anything.
In fact it is dangerous for your engine. For iron/steel hydrogen is an impurity worse than phosphor or sulphur.

This circuit could be used in other applications other than controlling a hydrogen generation cell. That's just what I originally thought of using it for when I started working on it. I'm tweaking it so it does what I want it to do. I didn't realize the part RadioRon posted was doing what it was supposed to and kept trying to figure out what was going on. I'm also working on getting the Operation LED to turn on and off when both sensors are open. I'm getting there, but its slow going.

LOL it's another HHO generator on ZeroFossilFuels, and of course it doesn't work. He's looking for donations to keep his guesswork research funded. skeeterb save your money and read and understand why HHO is a dead horse. It's been around for 200yrs and is not new but also not efficent. I'm not a government stooge and I know you post over at overunity.com but this HHO stuff is all smoke and mirrors. Spend your money on lowering your carbon footprint, then get solar or wind power setup (yep it's really expensive but will payoff vs HHO which is a moneypit)

Read this and the scientific proof link at the bottom to get a better understanding.
Run your car on water? - it's a scam!

skeeterb said:

This circuit could be used in other applications other than controlling a hydrogen generation cell. That's just what I originally thought of using it for when I started working on it. I'm tweaking it so it does what I want it to do. I didn't realize the part RadioRon posted was doing what it was supposed to and kept trying to figure out what was going on. I'm also working on getting the Operation LED to turn on and off when both sensors are open. I'm getting there, but its slow going.

Click to expand...

Lets make a summary.

UP sensor = 0, "Warn" keeps blinking, "OP" = 1.
UP sensor = 0 and LOW sensor = 0, "Warn" keeps blinking, "OP" keeps blinking, REF = 1.

That's it?

I wonder if you can put a resistor or zener inline with a blinking LED (to get rid of the 555)